Lift OneSelf -Podcast
Step into the serene sanctuary of self-care, where our journey of truth and mindfulness begins by dismantling the stigma surrounding mental health. Immerse yourself in profound conversations as we unravel the mysteries of mental health, meditation, and personal growth, exploring the profound impact of trauma on the nervous system. Join our nurturing community, where we uplift each other by sharing invaluable tools and services, gracefully navigating life's challenges with resilience. Prepare to awaken your mind, nourish your soul, and embrace the transformative journey of self-discovery.
As I traverse the vast expanse of the digital world, connecting with diverse voices across the globe, I invite others to share their stories and provide insights and tools. If you listen deeply, in every story you can catch a glimpse of yourself in the details.
Welcome to the Lift OneSelf podcast, where every dialogue sparks curiosity and ignites your spirit.
Explore our website at
www.LiftOneSelf.com
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Your time and presence are truly appreciated.
Remember, always be kind to yourself.
Lift OneSelf -Podcast
Transforming Lives with Tailored Therapy and Personality Insights
Ever considered that your personality could be the key to unlocking a more effective approach to therapy? We wade into the waters of how personality assessments can be more than just diagnostic tools; they can be stepping stones to personal evolution. Shannon and I dissect the concept of a static personality and champion the idea that intentional growth is not just possible but essential. From the nuances of managing emotions to the crafting of therapy that's as unique as the individuals it seeks to help, this episode is a testament to the malleability of our inner landscapes.
Wrapping up our journey, we address the necessity of self-care in the relentless whirl of academia and professional life, sharing insights and strategies to cultivate balance and well-being. Our discussion is a heartfelt reminder to grant ourselves permission to pursue joy and self-compassion, as Shannon and I reflect on the importance of self-permission in crafting a fulfilling life. Listeners seeking to reshape their narratives will find Shannon's empowering insights linked for easy exploration, leaving you with a gentle nudge—be kind to yourself, for it's in this kindness that your true potential blossoms.
Connect with Shannon here
Website
www.personality-compass.com
Social Media
Remember, the strongest thing you can do for yourself is to ask for help.
Please help us grow by subscribing to and sharing the Lift OneSelf podcast with others.
The podcast intends to dissolve the stigmas around Mental Health and create healing spaces.
I appreciate you, the listener, for tuning in and my guest for sharing.
Our website
Https://.LiftOneself.com
Find more conversations on our Social Media pages
www.facebook.com/liftoneself
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Music by prazkhanal
Remember to be kind to yourself.
Always do your own research before taking action.
Remember, the strongest thing you can do for yourself is to ask for help.
Please help us grow by subscribing to and sharing the Lift OneSelf podcast with others.
The podcast intends to dissolve the stigmas around Mental Health and create healing spaces.
I appreciate you, the listener, for tuning in and my guest for sharing.
Our website
LiftOneself.com
email:
liftoneself@gmail.com
Find more conversations on our Social Media pages
www.facebook.com/liftoneself
www.instagram.com/liftoneself
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Music by prazkhanal
Hi, hey, shannon, how are you Good? How are you? I'm well, I'm well. Can you hear me clearly? Yep, okay, great, great. Welcome to the Lift One Self podcast, where we break mental health stigmas through conversations. I'm your host, nat Nat, and we dive into topics about trauma and how it impacts the nervous system. Yet we don't just leave you there. We share insights and tools of self-care, meditation and growth that help you be curious about your own biology. Your presence matters. Please like and subscribe to our podcast. Help our community grow. Let's get into this. Oh, and please remember to be kind to yourself. Let's get into this. Oh, and please remember to be kind to yourself. Welcome to the Lift One Self podcast, shannon. I'm so thankful you're here with me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I'm really glad to be here.
Speaker 1:Will you join me in a meditation? I would love to For the listeners. Many of you are driving or using your visual. Please do not close your eyes when I ask Shannon to close her eyes, because I want you to be safe and for everyone around you to be safe. Otherwise, you can listen to the other prompts and you can follow them and enter into that meditation that way. So, shannon, I'll ask you to get comfortable and close your eyes and you're going to begin breathing in and out through your nose and you're going to bring your awareness to watching your breath go in and out through your nose. You're not going to try and control your breath, you're just going to be aware of it.
Speaker 1:While keeping your focus on watching your breath go in and out, there may be some sensations or feelings coming up in the body. You're safe to feel you're safe to let go. Surrender the need to control. You're safe to feel You're safe to let go. Surrender the need to control, release the need to resist and just be, be with your breath, drop into your body, continue staying with your breath, still continuing to stay with your breath, still continuing to stay with your breath and dropping deeper into the body, into the now. Now, while still staying with your breath at your own time and at your own pace, you're going to gently open your eyes and stay with your breath. How's your heart doing?
Speaker 2:It's good. I mean, I feel like my heart rate has slowed down a little bit and I feel in the present.
Speaker 1:Can you let the listeners know who Shannon is?
Speaker 2:know who Shannon is? Yeah, absolutely so. I wear a lot of hats, I am a wife and a mom. I have two daughters and I enjoy reading and being outside and just taking time with my family. I enjoy trying new foods. And then in my professional life I am a clinical psychologist and so I have a little private practice, but then my main gig is as a faculty member, a professor at the University of Kentucky. I do treatment outcome research, depression and some personality disorders, and test them to make sure they work and hopefully make them more potent and more efficient and more personalizable than what we have already.
Speaker 1:Nice. So you're in the academia and also in the private, so you're able to create some you know tools for people and then also apply it in your private practice to see. You know it's a win-win situation. What got you into this? What got you into being a psychologist and wanting to see the personalities?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I am definitely a strong kind of like emotion person. So I've always been like pretty empathetic and I've always been pretty like oriented towards how other people are feeling. But I definitely didn't know what to do with that early. You know in life.
Speaker 2:We actually had a psychologist come to my high school to give like a career day talk and I remember thinking at the time, no, that's way too much school and I wasn't really like the strongest student, which is like it comes as a real big surprise, I think, to my current students, because I'm like very, you know, like achievement oriented and organized and all of the stuff you'd expect for. You know like an academic, but I ended up taking an intro to psychology class just by chance. You know like an academic, but I ended up taking an intro to psychology class just by chance. You know, you just take it freshman year of college and was interested in it, right, and I remember like really starkly, like the class was at 8am and even though I was like not really like going consistently to all of my other classes, somehow I was able to get up and like get to class for every class meeting, did really well on the first exam and the TA was like.
Speaker 2:Shannon, you should seriously consider majoring in psychology. And I was like, okay, and I think it's like sort of an alignment. I was interested in it because I've always been kind of oriented towards other people. And now here is this like science that can help kind of explain it. And you know, I think, like I always, there's a lot of ways that you can study psychology. I knew I wanted to do something like in the clinical realm because I really wanted to work with people to help people feel better and as a therapist that's kind of on a like one-to-one level. And as I learned more about what clinical psychology could be, I got into research because I think figuring out why it's really hard to get access to mental health treatment, how to make treatments better so that therapists are more inclined to use the like interventions that we've developed and that we know work, felt like a way to to like kind of move the needle on a bigger scale. So kind of best of both worlds.
Speaker 1:yeah um, can you describe, for your description, what anxiety is? And for some listeners that, because we you know there's all kinds of different definitions for it. So how do you you view anxiety?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think of anxiety as a normal human emotion that we experience when there is something coming up in the future that's important, that we need to be vigilant for, that, we need to pay attention for right. So, like you know, with my college student clients, I you know it's like Right. So, like you know, with my college student clients, I you know it's like. You got a test on Friday, right, it is normal to feel anxious about that, right, and actually that's pathology. It's a thing that we're supposed to have.
Speaker 2:What I actually find with people that I work with is that you know, anxiety, right, or any emotion, is to prompt a behavior. Right, in the case of the test example, it's to study. But a lot of times our behaviors become more about making that emotion go down as fast as possible than it is about actually doing the thing the emotion is trying to tell you to do. And so you get so, like hello, procrastination, right, like in the test example, you get this quick relief and then, and then it becomes very acute the night before. Oh crap, like I have this test. And so you get this, this big rush.
Speaker 2:And so the difference between like anxiety, which we all feel and is by design and like an anxiety disorder would be like whether or not how you are responding to your emotion of anxiety is interfering in your life, keeping you from your goals and actually like kind of counterintuitively backfiring.
Speaker 2:So basically what happens is when people an anxiety disorder is like anxiety plus avoidance, and so you have anxiety and you try to avoid and those strategies work in the short term. But we have this thing called rebound effects, where you get your anxiety basically comes back more frequently and more strongly, and so it like you think you're solving the problem by avoiding right and it makes perfect logical sense to do that. You so it like you think you're solving the problem by avoiding right and it makes perfect logical sense to do that. You don't like feeling this way, so get rid of it backfires. So I like to clarify like anxiety normal, we have it, we don't want to get rid of it, and then we you know where we would seek treatment or an anxiety disorder. That's when how we are coping or how we're dealing with the anxiety is leading to interference in our life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know, like the clients that I work with, when I tell them, okay, we're going to engage with the anxiety, they're like what? I want to get rid of this. I'm like you need to understand the message and how I give it another part. I'm like, okay, you know what in life you're going to have to face pain. What we do is we run away, create all this suffering that builds up everything, only to come back to the same position that you're going to have to face the pain. But then you have all this baggage of suffering, this buildup that has been like a tumbleweed of just gathering and getting big.
Speaker 1:And so it's like, okay, well, let's question what the anxiety is trying to tell you, and I think that's where I don't hear to enough of that language. It's like, you know, pop a pill or there's something wrong or whatever. It's like, no, it's a messenger. What are you possibly, and what are you running in your head? What are the narratives that you've placed on yourself? To feel a sense of belonging, to feel a sense of perfection? You know, those are deeper things to deconstruct.
Speaker 1:Yet once you do that work, then the anxiety in your nervous system isn't on hypervigilance and activated because of a simple, you know thing because you're avoiding the messenger, your message. It's like such a breath of fresh air because a lot of times people are like all these tools and it's like, well, let's find out what the message is and let's interact with it. Because it's it's normal, like when I, I'm hearing, especially in the spiritual language, or people when they're like anger, don't get angry and angry so bad and it's worthless, and I'm like it's a bad emotion, like, yeah, you need a, you need a healthy relationship with anger, because a lot of times we project or can get into violence with our behavior because we're not listening, like you said, we're suppressing, yet have a healthy relationship with that anger. Can you give a little bit more information on what you see with anger and what could be done with people?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that, like a lot of the people that I see that like consider themselves to be, like you know, angry right, they they're not expressing their anger, like particularly frequently, there's a lot of fear around the idea that they're going to lose control, a lot of fear around what it means to be angry Right, and I think that really does come from societal message messages, I think, like anger gets a bad rap because it gets associated right With violence, with throwing your phone, with yelling, but that's not what anger is.
Speaker 2:Anger is a feeling in your body that says, hey, that wasn't cool, I need to tell that person to stop doing that. And if you didn't have that feeling, then you wouldn't know that you're being taken advantage of and you would get walked over right. Your boundaries would be crossed, the boundaries of the people that you love would be crossed right, because you're not going to notice and stand up for yourself. That's what anger does, right. Feeling anger in your body and using that message doesn't necessarily mean that you have to yell and scream and throw your phone. It can be. It prompts behavior and that behavior can be an assertive conversation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it takes work to you know, break the habits of repressing the anger and pushing it down. That it you're. You know it hijacks your behavior of like, listen, we got to do something about this. It needs some expression. You can't just ignore what has just happened yet we don't know how. Like you said, you know societal or even culturally or family dynamics. It's not allowed to feel the anger. It's like be in your know societal or even culturally or family dynamics. It's not allowed to feel the anger. It's like be in your room, stay by yourself and don't bother us with that dense energy. Right, tell us more about personality tests and what you are developing and what you see.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so I'll. I have kind of a long word to spiel into this, so I'll kind of I'll give it. There's kind of the background, right. So I mentioned I'm a treatment outcome researcher and one of the things that I you know that I've kind of been disenchanted with treatment development because there's this statistic that suggests that, like, if you are a person seeking therapy, you only have a 30% chance of actually getting an evidence-based or science-based intervention. You know where you're actually getting taught skills that we know work, and so that makes me kind of feel like, well, our treatments are.
Speaker 2:There's something like there's not something wrong with the therapists in practice, because everybody wants to do the best job and help their patients. The treat. There's not something wrong with the therapists in practice, because everybody wants to do the best job and help their patients. The treat. There's something up with the treatments that's like why they're not being, you know, widespread um used, and so basically there's a different treatment protocol or like manual for every disorder in theM, which is like for listeners, like our big book of mental health conditions, right, and so if you are like a therapist in private practice and you know you have a person come in at nine that has depression and a person that comes in at 10 that has generalized anxiety and a person that comes in at 11 with social anxiety. You're potentially using a different manual or intervention protocol. They're going to be similar but there are differences between them with each person and that means you can't get good at any of these because you're doing you just have a bunch of different balls in the air.
Speaker 2:And so the way that I sort of came to personality is that there's really good like kind of basic scientific research that says that certain personality traits can actually predispose us to have to develop different mental health conditions. And so it seemed to me that a more efficient system would be to target the vulnerabilities rather than target the you know like kind of the resultant symptoms. And when we think about like really good research on personality, there's basically like five main kind of dimensions on which people differ. And so I kind of thought, well, maybe we could just have five treatments and people could kind of take a personality assessment and we could kind of personalize and put together a treatment. And so it's easier for clinicians because there are, you know, there would be like a combination of five different treatments you could really learn them, get good at them, even if you're in a busy practice, and it's good for clients because you're getting more personalized and more potent interventions. So that's kind of like what brought me from just like broad, disorder-focused clinical intervention development to like focusing on personality.
Speaker 2:And as I started to develop and test interventions for personality change, you know a lot of people think, oh, your personality is your personality, it can't change, but we have really good data that suggests that it does. So. Then I got to thinking like well gosh, like how many times at work have I taken a Myers-Briggs or a disc or whatever and it tells me what my type is and what roles and jobs would be good for me. And honestly that started to like kind of like piss me off because I was. I'm like I don't want the test to tell me what I can do. I want to develop I, because personality can change. So like I don't like that messaging. Why don't we think about what we want to do in this life and then intentionally nudge our personality into a direction that would make those dreams more of a reality? So that's my winded my circle.
Speaker 1:I love it Because you know too many people are placed in boxes or they're seeking on the outside and they're not really taking time to do that introspection of what is it that I want to create in the world? What would light me up, what would get me up every morning with the mundane? Because you want something that, when it's like a shitty day, that passion will help you to get out of your bed, because you enjoy what you like, where a majority of the population they're getting out of bed just because of the paycheck and having to, you know, support the basic needs, and so I really appreciate that. You saw something. It's like you know this is kind of irritating me and it's only doing a fraction of something and not helping people to really explore their full potential and also to develop skills.
Speaker 1:Like you know, more and more we're understanding neuroplasticity. We're understanding that, yes, the nervous system gets wired a certain way in developmental stages, when you're a child and, sure, if you've experienced trauma, there's significant negative bias and you have to work at regulating your nervous system. Yet you have to understand your biology, you have to understand yourself and understand those triggers. Yet to think that a personality is only going to stay that way. It's like it's the wonderful sentence of you can't teach an old dog new tricks and it's like, well then, that gives a person an excuse just to stay that the way that they are, and it also makes a person feel like there's no possibility of healing, there's no possibility of change and transformation. And these boxes that have been created, I sometimes wonder, I'm like, who is that serving? Like, at the end of the day, who is that really serving to really limit people into certain boxes and not let them see the full spectrum and not let them see the full spectrum?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I feel like you know, it's like corporate this is now like my cynical side but it's like who's giving these tests? Corporations that want, like, greater productivity, like what is you know to what end? It's not. They're not giving you these tests so that you can self-actualize, Like if you're taking a test at work.
Speaker 1:Exactly, they're like let's see who can do what and the productivity and it's. You know, the reason why I do the work that I do too is because I really understand the nervous system and, as you saw just the meditation that we did at the beginning I have a part that you know my nervous system and the frequency of my voice allows safety.
Speaker 1:And if you know, you know the only way that you're going to get true healing is radical honesty. And to have radical honesty and to face yourself is it takes a lot of work because it feels very threatening, it's going against apologies and belief systems. Yet I was seeing that there was always still this missing piece that when people would come talk to me they're like well, I've done therapy but it's not getting vertically down and I don't know where to get that. And then when they've done some sessions with me, they're like I've gotten further along with you than I did.
Speaker 1:Two years of working with the therapist and I'm like I understand that, I understand, you know me dying, almost dying, 10 years ago and the lesions in my brain and cerebellum really let me see a front seating in the nervous system and my nervous system and got to really understand the language to it, not just these theories, not just these textbooks, so that relations and when I speak I can understand what people are going through. So I really appreciate that you are, you know, forging a path to bring proper healing to people. And I'm sure it can be very frustrating and like it's like can anybody else see the elephant in the room? Like why am I the only one seeing this elephant like what's going on? Has that been difficult to be in the academia space with that kind of determination and sometimes considered defiant?
Speaker 2:yeah, um, you, I think I've been pretty lucky in like the time that I'm working.
Speaker 2:So, like I think there are people you know, historically there have been personality researchers and treatment researchers and, like I said, like I'm much more of a treatment researcher but I had gone to graduate school at a place that really, like, was interested in personality, so I learned a lot in grad school and kind of just had that in the back of my mind, and so the personality researchers over here have been like working on these models of like vulnerability for mental health difficulties and, like you know, kind of based on personality, and so I think like all of that basic research that they've done has made it easier for me to be like hey, like why don't we treat that and um, it used?
Speaker 2:I've heard from colleagues that are um more senior to me that when they have applied to like the national Institute of health for grant funding, um, for sort of like personality, anything to do with personality, it hasn't really been um, they haven't had much luck in getting funding. But I like here recently, so I'm a I'm about to get a pretty big grant actually to to test these personality interventions and kind of personalized delivery of them, and so, and so I think, like the field is kind of coming around to this idea that like what we're doing, like these disorder specific treatments and trials, for that isn't really moving the needle. Like it they work for, like the individuals that get them, but in terms of a widespread dissemination, most people aren't getting them. So we got to do something different and I think that, like people are starting to see the writing on the wall.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, being in the mental health industry and, like you know, working at finding treatments and finding solutions. What are your, your concerns, right now that you're seeing with you know, especially you know, western society in the U? S. What are your concerns and what do you think the solutions can be?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, so one. I'll talk about two. I have two concerns. One is is the demand for mental health treatment here? You know, over the last five years it's increased exponentially. And people always ask me oh, like is our? Is our mental health as a country, as a, you know, as a world, like getting worse? And my answer is always I don't know, because you know there are multiple reasons why we see more people seeking therapy. Maybe, like they're, you know, with COVID and with all the stuff that's, you know, with all the just existential dread that's going on in the world, you know, maybe more people are struggling.
Speaker 2:At the same time, I also think that it is a lot easier to talk about mental health than it used to be. I think, like Gen Z is like cool with talking about their emotions, and so, you know, I mean, I work at a university and so I hear, like the college counseling centers are just like overrun with people because people feel more comfortable reaching out for help, and so I think that that's a. You know, it's kind of cool that people feel more comfortable reaching out for help and at the same time, there will probably never be enough trained therapists to meet the demand. And so, like, what do we do? We have to figure out what to do about that, right. And so I think personal, like thinking about personalizing the sort of level of care that people need is really important. Some people could benefit from like a self-help book, like that could be really eyeopening for them, or an on, maybe a more interactive online program, whereas another person might need a structured six week treatment, whereas another person might need, you know, one or two years of really kind of intensive therapy, and so kind of figuring that out and kind of triaging people into the right, the right fit, might make the system a little bit more, um, more efficient. And then I also think like being creative about who can deliver treatment. So in the States, like there's, like you know, licensing laws that make it really difficult for right, like make it difficult for people, you know, if you're not licensed with a particular degree to provide a therapy In the global mental health world, right, there's all the I mean there's a huge literature on researchers going into like low and middle income countries that have been like very recently torn apart by war and training people with less than a high school education to deliver cognitive behavioral therapy, and they do great right, and I think it, like we you know, as mental health professionals, are like oh, like it's really hard what we do, you couldn't do it, but like I think that that's the wrong approach because there will always be I mean, you can't be threatened by, you know like lay people learning how to do CBT or things that work so that they can help folks in their community, especially in communities where there aren't therapists, because there's always going to be people that are going to pay me to do therapy with them and like I can't treat everybody.
Speaker 2:I've been doing a lot of work. I'm in Kentucky and so I've been doing a lot of work in Appalachia, which is a rural region of my state, and there are like no mental health providers there, and so we've been thinking about like leveraging some of these findings from the global mental health world to think about training like people in churches and other sort of like community leaders that are trusted, that could could help people in that way. So I think that's one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a huge one. Thank you for that because I know I understand the accreditation world. And then when people come to me and they're like, will it be under your insurance? I'm like, no, it will not be able to be covered in your insurance, right? What does your self-care look like, shannon? Even you know you as a psychologist. You know all the things that would would have to be needed to support yourself and being prime optimal. Can you let us know what your self-care looks like and the? You know I work in a field where productivity is really valued.
Speaker 2:How much grant money do you have? How many publications do you have? You know, how much money do you make, Right, I mean less money in psychology, but, like you know, and so it's really easy as a person that is, like you know, high achieving and ambitious, to get really sucked up into those, those metrics, Right. And you know there are times I mean it's all circular or cyclical, right. So like there are times when I have like a grant deadline, um, that I, you know, okay, I really have to like work this weekend to do it, but for the most part, I try to remind myself that, like another publication isn't real. It only matters to like three other people in the world that are going to read the paper. And what I really want to do is like think of creative ways to help people. And in order to do that, I need like it's really hard to be creative. We've burnt out and tired and you're like at 9 PM after a full day working, again after you put your kids to bed, like that's not sustainable, it's not fun and it really takes the joy out of what I do and I really love my job, so. So for me, self-care looks like taking an SSRI. So I feel like that kind of takes the edge off that really strong desire to just like I got to keep doing more. I have to keep working.
Speaker 2:I noticed when I started taking it during COVID that all of a sudden, like I could leave work at five o'clock and not be like, well, let me just finish this one thing it it was a lot easier for me to say to myself I'll be there tomorrow, whatever, Um, and that's been great. So you know, since then I really don't work after five. I mean, I worked long days, I worked like eight to five, but I don't like my job. So that's fine, Um, but I don't. I don't work in the evenings.
Speaker 2:Like, once I'm home, I make dinner, I listen to a podcast, hang out with my kids. Really, unless there's like a grant deadline or something really you know extra, I'm not working on the weekends. I like to get out in my garden, I like to listen to music, I like to write, and so I do those things. And sometimes I get caught back up in, like the you know, the productivity cycle and I'm like, why do I feel like shit? And then I have to like very actively and intentionally remind myself to do the things that I know make me feel like a human.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you for that vulnerability and that honesty of the raw truth. I think you know being in a field of wanting to help people and there's an endless abyss. It's like there's a never ending and you really have to remember. Oh wait, I have to help myself, like I have to put on this mask and I have to walk the talk that I'm giving to other people so that it can be relatable, but also show like it's difficult, like we fall into these ruts or we get lured into this or that, and it takes, you know, interrupting yourself and being like wait, how am I feeling, what am I doing? And not being on this autopilot.
Speaker 1:And you know it really takes introspection to face, like I say, face those things, because there's things that are at risk, especially in academia, like you know grants and everything else. If I don't get the grant, then I can't do the trials and the projects and then I can't get that out to the people. So it's like you know having to navigate through that and being a parent on top of it and a wife, it's like all these multitude of places that want your attention. When do you take time for yourself? Does Shannon spell spend one-on-one time with herself?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So fortunately, my kids have gotten to the age where they are more interested in hanging out with other kids than they are with me, so they'll. So on the weekends they will go over to their friends' houses, like we have a bunch of kids in the neighborhood and so I will sit in my office and get a glass of glass, a cup of tea and read my book, and so that's really nice. I also, like I do have to travel some for work, and in this past year I've gotten to go to places, really cool places I had never been before. I got to go to Australia and one of the things that I've been doing lately.
Speaker 2:Well, I realized I actually really like traveling by myself. It's so fun, I can do whatever I want and there's nobody whining. And so I will have been, you know, very intentional around giving myself permission to stay another extra, another couple of days in the place and like see it and do some stuff and not feel guilty Like oh, I need to come home because my husband is like doing all the stuff with the kids. Like kind of giving myself permission to like do things that are joyful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you for doing that, because that changes the energy field and then it gives you a language of understanding why it can be so challenging for other women to break out of the narrative that they have to be that superwoman and that mom guilt that oh.
Speaker 1:I'm doing something for myself, but I should be sharing it with other people or doing the load or whatever it's like. No, you're allowed to just take care of yourself and enjoy your own time and your own needs, not worrying about, like you said, the whining and everything else because it has traveled with little humans in airports and in airplanes. You know the struggles that go on Right. I'm going to bring you into a reflective question. I'm going to ask you to take your awareness right now and go back to your 18-year-old self, and you have three words to tell your 18-year-old self to carry to the journey of right now. What would those words be?
Speaker 2:Perseverance confidence and joy.
Speaker 1:Do you give a little bit of detail? Why?
Speaker 2:Sure, yeah. So another reason I'm really interested in personality change is that I think that, like, my own personality has changed a lot. I don't think that I necessarily was reflecting on that when I got into this personality change research, but as I started to think more like why does this resonate so much with me? You know, I've been thinking. I've actually been thinking a lot about my younger self and you know, I was pretty like lazy, um, for lack of a better word like at my parent teacher conferences, people, my teachers, were always like oh, you're not, she's not living up to her potential, kind of thing. Um, and I was also pretty shy, Um, you know, I kind of knew that I had, or felt that I had, something to offer the world, but I like was sort of like why aren't people noticing that? Um, but wasn't really putting myself out there.
Speaker 2:So I think like perseverance is sort of like just kind of telling myself like, find something and stick to it. Um, confidence, kind of reminding myself that, like you know, I I feel like I haven't. I'm not a person that has struggled with a lot of like inner self-doubt or like imposter syndrome, Sort of. I'm like, when I make up my mind to do something, I'll do it.
Speaker 2:I just like didn't make up my mind to do things early on in my life, and so the confidence is just kind of reminding myself that like I just have to go out and get what is important to me Like no one's going to be like oh, she's special, and just hand it to me, and then I think joy, right, and I think that is just to to. You know, at 18, I I don't know, I mean I was fine, but I didn't. I didn't really, I don't know. I didn't know what to expect in terms of like how happy and good my life would turn out Right, and that, like you know, I think that if I might, if my 18 year old self could see me now, she would be like overjoyed.
Speaker 1:Right, great Now I know the listeners want to find out where can they find you, what you have to offer, so can you share that with the listeners?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. Probably the best or most direct place to find me is my website. Can they find you what you have to offer? So can you share that with the listeners? Yeah, absolutely so. Probably the best or most direct place to find me is my website, wwwpersonality-compasscom, and there you can find a free personality test that is based in science and of um couches personality at, or personality tests as your starting point. Um, you can also, once you've taken that test, you can, um, you can. There's like a page on my website that has all kinds of free downloadable worksheets that we use in our trials for personality change. That you can. That have instructions, right, that you can test them out.
Speaker 2:I also offer personality coaching, like single sessions after you've taken the test, to kind of talk through some strategies to nudge yourself in that direction. And then I'm also on all the other social media, right. Instagram is at self-made personality. Twitter or X is at sour Zavala, just my last name, and I don't know how you're supposed to say that you're on LinkedIn. I'm on LinkedIn, but there's no like handle.
Speaker 1:I don't. I haven't gone in that space so I don't know LinkedIn. Um, maybe I should uh try to swim in there, but yeah, well. Well, I want to thank you so much for being here and what you're doing. You know, you're putting the difference of really wanting to be there for the people and finding the tools to help humanity and find out what it is that they're good at and what their potentials are, and to like, give light that there is possibility of change. You're not just, you know, molded in one thing and that's you for the rest of your life, that you have the ability to re-sculpture and remold it. Is there something that you would like to leave the listeners?
Speaker 2:yeah, um, maybe let your dreams dictate the personality that you develop, rather than the other way around.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, Shannon, for being a guest and sharing your knowledge and your experience with the listeners.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1:And all of her information will be in the show notes. So please don't worry that you have to repeat and find it will all be clickable, because we're in a society that you know what. We all just want the hyperlinks and bring us directly there. So I will make sure that it's all there and you're able to get in contact with her very easily. Shannon, please remember to be kind to yourself, thank you.
